Botanical name: 

From: "jim mcdonald">
Subject: Re: [herb] Re: Lyme
Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 10:24:31 -0500

>I am working with a neighbor who has had Lyme for several years. She has had resorted to intravenous antibiotics four times and is currently on it. She feels like the antibiotics are slowly helping.

Small doses (3 drops/3 times a day) of Teasel root tincture can be curative for Lyme. Read about it in Matt Wood's Book of Herbal Wisdom (this is, I believe, the only source for written info on this). One of my students had lyme twice. The first time he went convential antibiotic route, and did fairly. Three years later he was bitten again and got really bad... he used teasel and seems to have recovered fully. Jeans Greens carries Teasel tincture.

>she hasn't been willing to accept that she should be consistent in her therapy

This, of course, is often what decides whether treatment will work or not. Impress on her that it can work if she sticks with it, but likely will not if she doesn't, then leave it up to her. Being well is a personal responsibilty.

From: May Terry

> Small doses (3 drops/3 times a day) of Teasel root tincture can be curative for Lyme.

I'm uncomfortable with I've stated before, I live about a 20 minute drive from Lyme, CT, and Lyme disease is epidemic around here. I have seem people have terrible chronic problems from Lyme, when they have supposedly "recovered fully". Of course I know the antibiotics are not foolproof. But I would be reluctant to just go and get myself some teasel tincture if I found the circular rash.

I've had it, by the way.

From: "Pamela Quayle"

>Small doses (3 drops/3 times a day) of Teasel root tincture can be curative for Lyme.

This is one of the things that we tried about three years ago - but the committment wasn't there at that time. I am considering it for after the antibiotics - I'm hoping she is ready to take that personal responsibility now.

Matt mentions in his book the importance of using brandy - because of the energetic level, I believe. I have teasel tincture I made from roots from the garden but it is made with grain alcohol which has been my preference because of the ability to vary percentage. Normally I would dismiss the importance of the difference, but his work is not what I consider "the norm". It seems from your postings, Jim, that you have some experience with his work and techniques. What do you think?

From: "jim mcdonald"

>I'm uncomfortable with this...

I'd certainly never tell anyone not to go for "conventional treatment". I'd just tell them I know someone first hand who's used both treatments, and who using Teasel worked for, and several years later he's still doing well. They can make their own descison from there. I've always felt that letting people decide for themselves where to draw the line between conventional nad herbal therapy is best, and that telling people they shouldn't have this or that conventional therapy is generally a bad idea. I just offer the info, and let them decide... its their responsibilty to make descions concerning their health, not mine.

But I'd use teasel.


Just to clarify ...I'd go just a bit further when it comes to letting the patient decide on whether to use conventional or an herbal therapy. A single dose of 200mg doxycycline is curative in the vast majority of cases in which an individual is bitten by a tick that is at least partially engorged with blood in an area where Lyme disease is common ...whereas after several months even combination antibiotic therapy has limited results. So then, if you're talking about therapy within 3 days, doxycycline is absolutely the first choice for anyone who has been bitten by a tick where there is a risk for Lyme disease. The combination of doxycycline and an herb, of course, can be suggested. If we're talking 30 days later or so, doxycycline and even the combination of doxycycline with another antibiotic has limited usefulness; therefore, herbal therapy, and perhaps in combination, can be strongly recommended. Yes ...the choice of therapy should always be the patients; however, herbalists who desire to maintain a more professional practice must guide the patient toward the best option ..and in the case of Lyme disease there is a definite distinction based on the length of time from bite to presentation. Perhaps, we're saying the same thing but I thought the issues should be further clarified.


Elliot Freeman RPh

Member, Association of Natural Medicine Pharmacists

From: Sharon Hodges-Rust

well Lyme's, Borrelia burgdorferi ,a spirochete and like another spirochete syphilis is better treated quickly and simply by antibiotics. The longer you have the disease the harder it is to get rid of it. Also the greater the chance for permanent damage. These critters like to settle in joints and the central nervous system. I don't really think that herbal medicine met the task of curing syphilis in the past and I don't think that it meets the mark for treating lyme's today. In 1926 Professor Von Jauregg of Austria was given the Nobel prize for his medical contribution- the treatment of paresis(brain infection with syphilis) with malaria. His treatment was to infect patients who had paresis with malaria trying to produce a high fever, the high fever would kill the syphilis in the brain enough that it saved 2/3 of these people's lives and to varying degrees their cognitive function, he gave no one person more than 12 fevers and he didn't treat the malaria until a fever of 106 was reached.

I am not recommending that people with chronic lyme's disease get malaria but maybe they should not be too quick in treating a fever, maybe they should support any fever they do get.

From: "Pamela Quayle"

>I am not recommending that people with chronic lyme's disease get malaria but maybe they should not be too quick in treating a fever, maybe they should support any fever they do get.

Hot baths to raise the body temp is one of the therapies used by David Winston. He also uses and sells a formula designed (I believe) to go after the spiroketes that is based on eclectic treatment of syphilis. Arduous, but he says effective. Or this is what he was teaching about 4 years ago.

I stress that this is for chronic Lyme, not newly acquired - there antibiotics are the thing to do.